Death of the tough defenseman...15 year retrospect

[The DZA]

I wanted to take a look at the lack of tough guys that play defense in the NHL these days, so I decided to compare the fighting majors for defensemen in todays NHL vs. the NHL 15 years ago. Obviously fights were up across the board 15 years ago, but if you look at the players, you can tell this type of a defenseman is a thing of the past.

Listed below are top 15 defenseman for fighting majors this year, and 15 years ago.

2008 - 2009 season:

1 – Steve Montador 13
2 – Matt Greene 9
3 – Shane O'Brien 9
4 – Matt Walker 9
5 – Sheldon Brookbank 8
6 – Brad Staubitz 8
7 – Jason Strudwick 8
8 – Erik Reitz 7
9 – Luke Schenn 7
10 – Craig Weller 7
11 – 7 players tied at 6


1993 - 1994 season:

1 - Cam Russell 22
2 - Dennis Vial 21
3 - Ken Baumgartner* 18
4 - Enrico Ciccone 18
5 - Lyle Odelein 17
6 - Greg Smyth 17
7 – Rudy Poeschek 16
8 – Doug Zmolek 15
9 – Jamie Huscroft 14
10 – Marty McSorley 14
11 – Dave Karpa 12
12 – Brent Severyn 12
13 – Paul Laus 11
14 – Mark Tinordi 11
15 – Terry Carkner 10

*played both defense and forward positions

[IceDog44]

Originally Posted by The DZA

I wanted to take a look at the lack of tough guys that play defense in the NHL these days, so I decided to compare the fighting majors for defensemen in todays NHL vs. the NHL 15 years ago. Obviously fights were up across the board 15 years ago, but if you look at the players, you can tell this type of a defenseman is a thing of the past.

Listed below are top 15 defenseman for fighting majors this year, and 15 years ago.

2008 - 2009 season:

1 – Steve Montador 13
2 – Matt Greene 9
3 – Shane O'Brien 9
4 – Matt Walker 9
5 – Sheldon Brookbank 8
6 – Brad Staubitz 8
7 – Jason Strudwick 8
8 – Erik Reitz 7
9 – Luke Schenn 7
10 – Craig Weller 7
11 – 7 players tied at 6


1993 - 1994 season:

1 - Cam Russell 22
2 - Dennis Vial 21
3 - Ken Baumgartner* 18
4 - Enrico Ciccone 18
5 - Lyle Odelein 17
6 - Greg Smyth 17
7 – Rudy Poeschek 16
8 – Doug Zmolek 15
9 – Jamie Huscroft 14
10 – Marty McSorley 14
11 – Dave Karpa 12
12 – Brent Severyn 12
13 – Paul Laus 11
14 – Mark Tinordi 11
15 – Terry Carkner 10

*played both defense and forward positions

At least Montador is still representin'

[pigfarmer]

I think it is tough to say something along these lines going by the numbers alone.

From 1993 to 2008 fights per game are something along the lines of 0.85 and 0.60 respectively. That is we only have 70% of the fights as 15 years ago.

Look at the league leaders over these two years and you get 38 to 25, or 66% of the fights.

Now compare the leaders of this list. From 22 to 13, that is basically 60% of the fights. (The top 15 you have up here account for 1/2 of the total fights from 2008 to 1993.)

I think we are seeing that the defenseman of 2008 does not see himself as dispensible to the team, with so many penalty kills/dressing 5 D-men. Or are we seeing more cycling of fighters between AHL and NHL clubs?, I can not comment on 1993.

As to saying this type of defenseman is a thing of the past, I think there is hope. Look at your list and we have Staubitz and Strudwick who played less than half a season each, yet were able to be in the top 10 fighting D.

[Skorka85]

Part of the problem is the rule changes. What can a defenseman do to really piss off a forward enough to make them want to fight? You can't cross check guys in front of the net, you can't battle anymore. It's no wonder defensemen don't fight as much as forwards these days.

[Purely_Purinton]

I think most of it has to do with the rule changes and speed of the game now, as teams (especially in playoff time) will double shift the top 2 pairs, and the 3rd pair sits there for 5 min anyway. As recently as 03-04 we saw teams having the likes of Purinton, Cairns, Brookbank, Belak, Brad Ference, Brad Brown and Todd Simpson patrol the blueline. Suddenly post lockout, these guys either moved to forward, or were sent down or released. How many fighters coming up now played D at one point but are stuck on a wing when they become a viable option for a NHL enforcer? Bissonette, MacIntyre and Koci to name a few. Especially now that you can't lay a finger on any of these big dumb Euro "premier power forwards" that park their stupid asses in front, they're far more valuable crashing guys through the boards on the forecheck, than getting caught flatfooted trying to play NHL caliber defense.

[HordiBrusk29]

Originally Posted by Skorka85

Part of the problem is the rule changes. What can a defenseman do to really piss off a forward enough to make them want to fight? You can't cross check guys in front of the net, you can't battle anymore. It's no wonder defensemen don't fight as much as forwards these days.

Exactly. Not to mention the fact most defenseman that still play that way (after the lockout) were soon out of jobs.

Many physical defensemen in the game today are now converted to forward and play both positions.

[CapsFan99]

can't forget Chara, he doesn't have high FM's but when he hits you it's bone crushing, literally.