Old Farts Thread

[fansince65]

Originally Posted by hockey doc

Totally agree with Ciccarelli. 2nd place might go to Dale Hunter, a no good rotten bastard that posted good numbers. How many times did Hunter get suspended for trying to end somebodys career with a cheap shot? He was brutal.

Dale Hunter is the coach owner of the London Knights along with brother Mark and to a lesser degree Basel McRae ..I have season tickets ...

He has mellowed out some , but still tells it like it is , gives the ref's a hard time every chance he gets , doesn't get thrown out of games as often anymore ..

His big problem right now with the team he is trying to turn his no talent son(Tucker) into the player he was , just not going to happen , the young man is an excellent student in school , real nice kid to talk to , but he just cant seem to grasp the basics of the game and he has been at for three years .
He is just wasted space on the team when their are more talented players in the system..
But if I owned the team my kids would be given every chance to make it also ....

[haz-ben]

Originally Posted by Maggie3and Me

Since the topic of pests came up, I couldn't sleep last night so I went searching for information. This should explain what a pest is and who they are in todays game.

Then I stumbled across the Legends list of the TOP 10 Alltime.

NHL Pests

Quote:
Encyclopedia > Pest (hockey)
In ice hockey, a pest is a type of player who attempts to annoy, anger, or distract opposing players in order to reduce their effectiveness or cause them to take a penalty. Pests are also sometimes referred to as "agitators".
Pests can employ legal, illegal, or borderline tactics to accomplish their goals. Some common tactics include trash talk or slashing and hooking while referees are not looking. Also, they may employ the tactic of goading opponents into a fight but then backing off in order to draw a penalty against the opponent. Some pests may not only use these tactics against opposing skaters, but opposing goaltenders as well.

Quote:

Fans may disagree about which players are pests, particularly when the player in question is on a favorite team. However, these players are sometimes called pests:
• Sean Avery
• Matthew Barnaby
• Alexandre Burrows
• Dino Ciccarelli
• Matt Cooke
• Dan Hinote
• Tomas Holmström
• Bob Kelly
• Ian Laperriere
• Kirk Maltby
• Tyson Nash
• Ville Nieminen
• Esa Tikkanen
• Darius Kasparaitis
•
Quote:
• For all his best efforts, Sean Avery has yet to do anything noteworthy, other than date Elisha Cuthbert. Avery can't wave his stick as the game's true best pests of all time:

1.Claude Lemieux. I think Avery's game, both in terms as an incessant needler and rugged forward, best resembles dirty Claude Lemieux's. But Avery can't wave his stick in the face of what Claude accomplished: Three Stanley Cups, 1 Conn Smythe Trophy, 19 playoff game winning goals and five 30+ goal seasons. Avery doesn't even come close.

2. Bobby Clarke. Years after retiring there was plenty of people who believed Clarke was still the biggest pest in the NHL (hello Mr. and Mrs. Lindros!). Though he was one of the dirtiest players of the 1970s, he generally escapes "best pests" threads because he was such a great player. He is a Hall of Famer after all.

3. Theoren Fleury. Before he reached the NHL, Theoren Fleury was at the centre of one of the most controversial moments in World Junior history: “The Punch-Up in Piestany.” He never changed his ways in the NHL, and, personal demons aside, was incredibly successful. 1088 points, 1 Stanley Cup, 1 Olympic gold medal.

4. Esa Tikkanen. "The Grate One" was smart enough to play left wing with the real "Great One," something that Wayne Gretzky always lacked. When 99 went to Hollywood, this hard driving Finn became Gretzky's most effective shadow. "Tik" was also an Olympian and 5 time Stanley Cup champion. He should have won a Selke trophy too.

5. Dale Hunter. This guy was relentless. And he crossed the line on a few occasions. But he was very much considered to be the leader of both the 1980s Quebec Nordiques and 1990s Washington Capitals. He scored 1020 points in the NHL.

6.Ken Linseman. "The Rat." His nickname says it all, although it originally referred to his looks more so than his play. It's easy to forget that, considering he made a living making sure to get in the first and last shots while distracting his opponent up and down the ice. Linseman's antics often resulted in only the retaliatory infraction being called, further incensing his targets -- who often spent the rest of the game preoccupied with trying to get even. He also had 807 points in 860 games.

7. Tony Leswick. Mighty Mouse was the best pest of the Original Six. He left a lot of hard feelings on a nightly basis with both Rocket Richard and Gordie Howe. The 5'7" Leswick never backed down, and blanketed both with great efficiency.

8. Stan Mikita. One of the greatest players of all time and another Hall of Famer, Mikita started his career establishing himself as one of the dirtiest players in the game. But after his daughter questioned his style of play, Mikita vowed to clean up his act and did just that by registering only six minor penalties in 1966-67. He would be honored with the first of two consecutive Byng trophies for gentlemanly play.

9. Tiger Williams. The NHL's all time penalty minute leader. He may not have been the best fighter, but he never backed down. He scored 35 goals and went to the All Star game one year, too.

10. Pat Verbeek. He wasn't called the Little Ball of Hate because he topped 1,000 career points and 500 career goals. But he did, including 8 seasons of at least 30 goals.

Point being, Mr. Avery, you have to do a hell of a lot more than agitate before you're going to be considered as the best pest of all time.
•
• Posted by Joe Pelletier at 8:06 PM

Wow that is some list. I would think with all of those names listed he would have mentioned names like Polonich, Ulfie and a couple other pest/dirty guys.

[bigjack]

Originally Posted by Maggie3and Me

Since the topic of pests came up, I couldn't sleep last night so I went searching for information. This should explain what a pest is and who they are in todays game.

Then I stumbled across the Legends list of the TOP 10 Alltime.

NHL Pests

Quote:
Encyclopedia > Pest (hockey)
In ice hockey, a pest is a type of player who attempts to annoy, anger, or distract opposing players in order to reduce their effectiveness or cause them to take a penalty. Pests are also sometimes referred to as "agitators".
Pests can employ legal, illegal, or borderline tactics to accomplish their goals. Some common tactics include trash talk or slashing and hooking while referees are not looking. Also, they may employ the tactic of goading opponents into a fight but then backing off in order to draw a penalty against the opponent. Some pests may not only use these tactics against opposing skaters, but opposing goaltenders as well.

Quote:

Fans may disagree about which players are pests, particularly when the player in question is on a favorite team. However, these players are sometimes called pests:
• Sean Avery
• Matthew Barnaby
• Alexandre Burrows
• Dino Ciccarelli
• Matt Cooke
• Dan Hinote
• Tomas Holmström
• Bob Kelly
• Ian Laperriere
• Kirk Maltby
• Tyson Nash
• Ville Nieminen
• Esa Tikkanen
• Darius Kasparaitis
•
Quote:
• For all his best efforts, Sean Avery has yet to do anything noteworthy, other than date Elisha Cuthbert. Avery can't wave his stick as the game's true best pests of all time:

1.Claude Lemieux. I think Avery's game, both in terms as an incessant needler and rugged forward, best resembles dirty Claude Lemieux's. But Avery can't wave his stick in the face of what Claude accomplished: Three Stanley Cups, 1 Conn Smythe Trophy, 19 playoff game winning goals and five 30+ goal seasons. Avery doesn't even come close.

2. Bobby Clarke. Years after retiring there was plenty of people who believed Clarke was still the biggest pest in the NHL (hello Mr. and Mrs. Lindros!). Though he was one of the dirtiest players of the 1970s, he generally escapes "best pests" threads because he was such a great player. He is a Hall of Famer after all.

3. Theoren Fleury. Before he reached the NHL, Theoren Fleury was at the centre of one of the most controversial moments in World Junior history: “The Punch-Up in Piestany.” He never changed his ways in the NHL, and, personal demons aside, was incredibly successful. 1088 points, 1 Stanley Cup, 1 Olympic gold medal.

4. Esa Tikkanen. "The Grate One" was smart enough to play left wing with the real "Great One," something that Wayne Gretzky always lacked. When 99 went to Hollywood, this hard driving Finn became Gretzky's most effective shadow. "Tik" was also an Olympian and 5 time Stanley Cup champion. He should have won a Selke trophy too.

5. Dale Hunter. This guy was relentless. And he crossed the line on a few occasions. But he was very much considered to be the leader of both the 1980s Quebec Nordiques and 1990s Washington Capitals. He scored 1020 points in the NHL.

6.Ken Linseman. "The Rat." His nickname says it all, although it originally referred to his looks more so than his play. It's easy to forget that, considering he made a living making sure to get in the first and last shots while distracting his opponent up and down the ice. Linseman's antics often resulted in only the retaliatory infraction being called, further incensing his targets -- who often spent the rest of the game preoccupied with trying to get even. He also had 807 points in 860 games.

7. Tony Leswick. Mighty Mouse was the best pest of the Original Six. He left a lot of hard feelings on a nightly basis with both Rocket Richard and Gordie Howe. The 5'7" Leswick never backed down, and blanketed both with great efficiency.

8. Stan Mikita. One of the greatest players of all time and another Hall of Famer, Mikita started his career establishing himself as one of the dirtiest players in the game. But after his daughter questioned his style of play, Mikita vowed to clean up his act and did just that by registering only six minor penalties in 1966-67. He would be honored with the first of two consecutive Byng trophies for gentlemanly play.

9. Tiger Williams. The NHL's all time penalty minute leader. He may not have been the best fighter, but he never backed down. He scored 35 goals and went to the All Star game one year, too.

10. Pat Verbeek. He wasn't called the Little Ball of Hate because he topped 1,000 career points and 500 career goals. But he did, including 8 seasons of at least 30 goals.

Point being, Mr. Avery, you have to do a hell of a lot more than agitate before you're going to be considered as the best pest of all time.
•
• Posted by Joe Pelletier at 8:06 PM

You don't always appreciate a player until you get to watch them up close and that is what happened to me with Verbeek. Man he played some great hockey as a Ranger and the team really needs that today. Verbeek was a later healthier Danny Gare to me. Great hands, a rat bastid, he'd do anything to win like Gare did. The only problem with Gare was his bad back but when healthy he was some great package and so was Verbeek!

[Johnny Pie]

I think Johnny Pie Mckenzie and Bryan Watson belong on any all time super pest lists. Watson was getting under star players skin way back in the 60's and was a pretty fearless fighter who could play the game. He got both Orr and Hull to drop the gloves. Johnny Pie was another who could stir up trouble with the best of them. He had the rep of being a cheapshot artist but he held a big part in the Big Bad Bruin era. He also was a damn good player who was very important to that team.

[BENNETTWOLF]

Keith Acton popped into my head as i guy that morphed from a high scorer to an annoying pest. God i wanted to see him get pasted. I'm sure that i'll come up with a couple that haven't been mentioned. Duane Sutter was more honest and honorable.

There's a great clip of Russ Anderson (who is rarely caught on video) coldcocking and dropping Linesman. I think it's the same game that Behn Wilson had it out with hall of fame worthy (irritant category) Paul Baxter.

[bigjack]

Originally Posted by Johnny Pie

I think Johnny Pie Mckenzie and Bryan Watson belong on any all time super pest lists. Watson was getting under star players skin way back in the 60's and was a pretty fearless fighter who could play the game. He got both Orr and Hull to drop the gloves. Johnny Pie was another who could stir up trouble with the best of them. He had the rep of being a cheapshot artist but he held a big part in the Big Bad Bruin era. He also was a damn good player who was very important to that team.

Ole Pieface was a jackoff but could play especially after being dealt by the Rangers to Boston for Reg Fleming. He was clearly helped by expansion and was a better player after the end of the 1942-67 origional 6 league!
From 1967-72, McKenzie had 5-20 goal years in a row with one year being over 30 goals and then at age 34 went to the WHA and played all 7 seasons there scoring over 20 goals 5 times and making 19 in his final season with 47 points and over 100 penalty minutes at age 41.
Pie McKenzie ended up scoring over 360 goals and almost 900 points and over 1,500 penalty minutes combined in the NHL and WHA!
The amazing thing is that in the summer of 1972 when it was apparant that the Bruins couldn't resign him, they sold him to the Flyers. Imagine that guy as a member of the Broad Street Bullies Flyers!
Wow what an asshole he would of been then!

[FitzG]

How about Nevin Markwart

[Maggie3and Me]

Originally Posted by Johnny Pie

I think Johnny Pie Mckenzie and Bryan Watson belong on any all time super pest lists. Watson was getting under star players skin way back in the 60's and was a pretty fearless fighter who could play the game. He got both Orr and Hull to drop the gloves. Johnny Pie was another who could stir up trouble with the best of them. He had the rep of being a cheapshot artist but he held a big part in the Big Bad Bruin era. He also was a damn good player who was very important to that team.

Johnny Pie,

Bryan "Bugsy" Waston. I did a post on him in the remember when section awhile ago. I will never forget him being assigned to shadow Bobby Hull or the chaos that resulted from that. He was a pisser.

I always felt that McKenzie was more chiken sh*t than Watson and not nearly as tough. I saw Watson fight more than once Johnny, and you're right about him having balls.

Back in the days of the Original Six it seems you either grew them or got feed them.

[Maggie3and Me]

Originally Posted by FitzG

How about Nevin Markwart

Nevin Markwart Career Statistics.

Seasons 7 1/2 W/ Boston claimed by Calgary 1/2season.

Games 309
Goals 41
Assists 68
Points 109
PIM 794

Played from 1983-84 to 1991-92

P.S. Did you see him play? If so, tell us about him.

[bigjack]

Originally Posted by Maggie3and Me

Nevin Markwart Career Statistics.

Seasons 7 1/2 W/ Boston claimed by Calgary 1/2season.

Games 309
Goals 41
Assists 68
Points 109
PIM 794

Played from 1983-84 to 1991-92

P.S. Did you see him play? If so, tell us about him.

Not big but alot of heart and guts and a good scrapper for his size. The guy was always injured and that ruined his career!
Had a great toe to toe scrap with George McPhee at MSG!

[Maggie3and Me]

bigjack,

Thanks for the information jack. I looked at his stats and wondered what happened. 8 full seasons would be 640 games. He only played in 309.

Then I took another look at his PIM and figured this was a pretty tough kid.


M3M

[Maggie3and Me]

Bryan “Bugsy” Watson

Johnnie pie, I had put together a piece on Watson , however, I cannot find the original. I went back to my sources and collected this information. I hope you like it johnnie.

As a Blackhawk fan, Bugsy is the stuff of lore. It was during the 1965-66 semi finals against the hated Red Wings, that Bryan got his nick name. Some say it was Bobby Hull, others say his teammates. He was told to stay on Bobby Hull and stay he did. He actually drew Hull into a fight along with upsetting the entire Blackhawk team. Unfortunately, I did not see this, as I was gone.

I will start of with his nick name and then give some other information I gathered.

Quote:

In 1966, during a semi-finals game against the Blackhawks, Watson, as a Red Wing, bothered Bobby Hull like an irritating rash, holding the power winger to only one goal in the series. Hull named his persistent antagonist "Super Pest."

Nicknamed "Bugsy" by Gordie Howe and Alex Delvecchio, Bryan Watson was known to be an agitator extraordinaire. He bothered people, doing whatever it took to make them lose their concentration.

In spite of Bryan's small size (5'9" and 175 Ibs), most people were distinctly aware of his presence. Ken Schinkel, a former teammate and coach of Bryan once said " Bryan is very verbal, and will take whatever steps are necessary to do his thing. That thing means to get into fights, give elbows, and make people boo when he comes to the ice."

Schinkel also recalled when he played against Bryan.

"I felt it when Bryan came to say hello in the corners. You always knew you got hit when Bugsy got to you. "

Watson himself used to say that the contact felt good and got his circulation moving. Pete Stemkowski of the Rangers called him a "Madman". Denis Potvin once described how during a fight Bryan drove his head right into his cheek. Anything counted in Bryan's book. His style of play could easily be seen on his PIM totals. Bryan had 2212 Pim's in only 878 games.

Intimidation was the name of the game for Bryan. He was a pretty bad skater and shooter but he had more guts than most players and that is what kept him in the NHL for such a long time. He only scored 17 goals in the 878 games and had 152 points.

A loyal and absolutely fearless player who never hesitated to stop pucks with his head if the situation called for it, Bryan was a great teammate. In the dressing room he was always on the lookout for a good practical joke. He knew when to lighten the bench, and when to set a fire under someone's ass. He was definitely one of those players who every team liked to have on their side.

But among his opponents he was the kind of player that you loved to hate in the same fashion as an Eddie Shack, Theoren Fleury, or Sean Avery. In other words, you loved to have him on your team but you hated to play against him, because he could be really mean.

This Bancroft, Ontario native played his junior career for the Peterborough Petes in the OHA. He then toiled a short while in the minors before being called up to the Montreal Canadiens where he played 39 regular season games during the 1963-64 season as well as 6 playoff games, but he didn't make much of a name for himself. It was apparent that Bryan's bruising style was not going to fit the fleet style of play that the Canadiens were noted for, so they traded him to Chicago on June 8, 1965. One day later he was claimed by Detroit in the intra-league draft.

Watson spent two years in Detroit, drawing some praise for his job checking Bobby Hull in the 1966 playoffs. Yet he would be claimed by Minnesota in the expansion draft in 1967. The North Stars traded him back to Montreal the same day. Once again he had a short stint with the Canadiens and spend most of his time in the AHL and CHL. Needless to say, Watson's luggage was starting to get worn out after all this movement.

It was during the 1967-68 season that Bryan drew some fame. He managed to lead the CHL in penalty minutes (293) in only 50 games, but he also was named the best defenseman in the CHL as well as being the MVP of the league and a first team All-Star.

He was traded to Oakland in 1968 and then to Pittsburgh in 1969. He managed to stay over 5 seasons in the Steel City, and led the NHL with 212 PIMs in 1971-72.

But Bryan continued to be a well traveled player. He played in St. Louis and Detroit once again before finishing his career with three seasons in Washington. In 878 NHL games he scored just 17 times while setting up 135 others. He retired with 2212 PIMs, then a NHL all time record.

After a short coaching tenure with the early 1980s Edmonton Oilers, Watson would stay in the Washington area in retirement, opening up Bugsy’s Pizza Restaurant & Sports Bar in nearby Alexandria, Virginia.

[bigjack]

Originally Posted by Maggie3and Me

bigjack,

Thanks for the information jack. I looked at his stats and wondered what happened. 8 full seasons would be 640 games. He only played in 309.

Then I took another look at his PIM and figured this was a pretty tough kid.


M3M

http://www.dropyourgloves.com/Fights...264#Fight21264

Here is that fight from drop your gloves. Thanks for mentioning that site a few weeks back!

What a slugfest and each guy was injured. McPhee broke his right hand and went lefty!

WOW!

[bigjack]

Pound for pound, George McPhee might of been the best fighter ever and he played with a very bad back and brace! 5'9" and 170lbs and what a fighter!

[fansince65]

Originally Posted by bigjack

Pound for pound, George McPhee might of been the best fighter ever and he played with a very bad back and brace! 5'9" and 170lbs and what a fighter!

You would think you were describing me here Jack , but I am not George McPhee !!
I played with a back brace also , was 5-9 165 - 170 and just loved to fight ...

George was one of my all time favorites because of his heart , he gave 110% all the time , and this from a player that when he was off the ice could not walk half a mile because of his back , that took more courage just to play then any player other then the great Bobby Orr , they both used crutches to get to the arena ....