Brian McGrattan vs Joe Kocur?

[srehm1]

Originally Posted by BaddaBing Badda Boom

Jackson? Don't know which one.

Could not agree more with you. The KO issue is blown way out of proportion relative to his 286 fights, way out!

I mean are we talking actual KO's? he only had a few. combined with tko's and kd's-he had a lot and probably is the top dog in that dept. because of his power-fighters fought him differently, more cautious and not as willing to open up against him. those that did were playing russian roulette because that bomb could land and hurt you.

Mcgrattan also has good power. it doesn't show up in the stat sheet but I always felt he had good power and could take you out if he could land flush. in fact a lot of the modern era fighters are like that-anyone of them could drop a guy if they landed solidly. now mcgrattan only has about 3 or 4 TKO's in his career out of 70+ NHL fights, but he definitely has good power.

[srehm1]

One of the great things I like about McGrattan is his card. he was a big time HW fighting at a time when the pool of HW's was shrinking. he was basically taking on the same group of HW's all the time - Orr, godard, peters, boogey, belak etc. He is fighting at a time when the DH enforcers only fight each other and as time has gone by, fewer of them remain-so he fights less and dresses for less games. Comparing his fight card from dyg ( just the names, not the results) to fighters appearing in merlin;s top-10 thread-more than half of mcgrattan's career fights have been against fellow top-10 fighters or fighters that were top-10 at some point. that is awesome. very few can claim that. unfortuantely, mcgratts will finish his career in the 100 fight range. if he had fought in that 85-95 range-he would have a few hundred figths against all calibers of fighters from HW's to LHW's to MW's the occasional non fighter as well. some of these guys were born at the wrong time! imagine godard vs. probert? mcgrattan vs. brown? boogaard vs. mckenzie? would have been great to watch.

[BaddaBing Badda Boom]

Originally Posted by acdcrocksno1

Certainly an unteresting match up a lot closer than people are saying, I can't see Kocur losing a 10 fight series though.

McGrattan vs Cote Jan 20, 2008 - YouTube

If Cote could do this to him I'm sure Kocur could acheive a similair effect. Also on punching power see how many flush shots McGrattan landed on Stevie Mac? Ever seen Kocur land that many and have the guy still swinging back?

We can select anything....to make a point

McGrattan vs Domi - YouTube

[BaddaBing Badda Boom]

Originally Posted by srehm1

I mean are we talking actual KO's? he only had a few. combined with tko's and kd's-he had a lot and probably is the top dog in that dept. because of his power-fighters fought him differently, more cautious and not as willing to open up against him. those that did were playing russian roulette because that bomb could land and hurt you.

Mcgrattan also has good power. it doesn't show up in the stat sheet but I always felt he had good power and could take you out if he could land flush. in fact a lot of the modern era fighters are like that-anyone of them could drop a guy if they landed solidly. now mcgrattan only has about 3 or 4 TKO's in his career out of 70+ NHL fights, but he definitely has good power.

As a percentage of their fights does not Ray and Orr edge out Kocur in the KO dept?

[Plateworker]

Originally Posted by BaddaBing Badda Boom

You know I have heard this tougher era bit...Really beg to differ here, I mean if you haven't already roll up and take a look at MCG's opponents...I think that the era thing is a red herring. Heck! My era was the 70s, and 80s - no less the ware....Kocur was the toughest of the tough but not unbeatable - Am sure that if Kocur's name was sloted into the mix of McGratten's fight card it would not jump out at you as it would seem almost common place in the context of all the other behemoths, nut jobs, techical fighters, brawlers, boxers, strong men, etc....

I think your wrong as I mostly do. Of course JK's era was tougher I really don't think its debatable. Today if you have half the teams with legit HW's that would be saying something. Where as McGratten fights all HW's, the caliber is no where near as is JK's day, Hell even when JK was ending his career it was tougher. Take your beloved Rangers in 97 Cairns, Vandy, Beuk, Churla, Bluoin and Langdon all on one team. Beating anyone of them is beating a legit HW, 4 of whom all played Regularly. McGratten has to worry about one guy and one guy only and that is if he is lucky a team has a HW. JK has over 260 fights at one point over 5 years and went 50-1-16 while beating Brash, Twist, Tinordi, Gaetz, McRae 2x, Grimson 2x, A.May, Ray 2x, Miller, Bomber, Carkner, McSorley, Odelein, Donnelly, Vukota and Berube all of which would give McGratten a fight if not outright beat him. I really don't think a guy who has under 100 fights and not exactly tested by all timers in his career gets the nod in a ten fight series. Brian is nothing that JK has not seen and beaten before. This era is in no way shape or form as tough as when JK was fighting.

[srehm1]

Originally Posted by BaddaBing Badda Boom

As a percentage of their fights does not Ray and Orr edge out Kocur in the KO dept?

ray 3 KO's in 290 fights
Kocur 3 KO's in 262 fights
orr 2 KO's in 115 fights

kocur also had that brutal KO of Jim playfair a few weeks before his first NHL fight. For those that count AHL fights and such.

[Plateworker]

Originally Posted by smashem

Not to be a jerk but half those dudes Miggy would beat with his left hand

Well if your not going to be a jerk at least get the point which was why would anyone think McGratten would give Kocur a problem when he fought guys his size and beat them all the time. If he is beating Brash, Grimson, Tinordi, Gaetz, Twist and such why would he have a problem with Brian. My Point is he would not...

[Plateworker]

Originally Posted by srehm1

ray 3 KO's in 290 fights
Kocur 3 KO's in 262 fights
orr 2 KO's in 115 fights

kocur also had that brutal KO of Jim playfair a few weeks before his first NHL fight. For those that count AHL fights and such.

Kocur also has 13 TKO's
Ray has 9 TKO's

[bruiser11]

Kocur. If that right ever connected that's it!

[I like Boobs]

Originally Posted by srehm1

ray 3 KO's in 290 fights
Kocur 3 KO's in 262 fights
orr 2 KO's in 115 fights

kocur also had that brutal KO of Jim playfair a few weeks before his first NHL fight. For those that count AHL fights and such.

Kocur also had a much better overall record, and mauled Ray a few times.

[BENNETTWOLF]

Originally Posted by BaddaBing Badda Boom

As a percentage of their fights does not Ray and Orr edge out Kocur in the KO dept?

It's possible Paul Laus is in consideration as well. Actually Curt Fraser had 4 legitimate KO's in probably 100-125 fights. While KO/TKO % might be miniscule, being in that feared group isn't.

To show how ironic KO "stuff" is, i'm pretty sure Scott Mellanby had 3.

[BaddaBing Badda Boom]

Originally Posted by Plateworker

Well if your not going to be a jerk at least get the point which was why would anyone think McGratten would give Kocur a problem when he fought guys his size and beat them all the time. If he is beating Brash, Grimson, Tinordi, Gaetz, Twist and such why would he have a problem with Brian. My Point is he would not...

perhaps....but do not think you made your argument

McGrattan vs Brashear Mar 25, 2006 - YouTube

[BaddaBing Badda Boom]

Originally Posted by srehm1

ray 3 KO's in 290 fights
Kocur 3 KO's in 262 fights
orr 2 KO's in 115 fights

kocur also had that brutal KO of Jim playfair a few weeks before his first NHL fight. For those that count AHL fights and such.

*WHL Orr KOs Ryan Flinn

So, they all r basically in the same camp. Orr's KOs of Fedoruk and Carkner are on a par with Kocur's; Kyte, Playfair -----

My point is that the difference is negligible and that the hooooooopla is a bit overstated. BTW: Ernie Shavers arguablly the hardest hitting heavyweights during Cassius Clay, Joe Frazier, George Foreman, Ron Lyle, Jimmy Young, Jerry Quarry and Ken Norton's day was never remotely the champ ----

[BaddaBing Badda Boom]

Originally Posted by Plateworker

Kocur also has 13 TKO's
Ray has 9 TKO's

Orr has at least 7 TKO's in 115 games. The same pace as Kocur.

[BaddaBing Badda Boom]

Originally Posted by bruiser11

Kocur. If that right ever connected that's it!

If, If , If - How about kudos to the guys that were smart enough to tie him up and not get hurt? - As far as I know all these combatants are still alive, so lets not get too dramatical.