Lightning Have Mixed Emotions Over Neil's Hit

[Cat Smasher]

Originally Posted by The Crow

Is there something against a player voicing his opinion on a hit?

Not at all, unless said player didn't even try to do anything about it during the rest of the game.

Did Neil turn him down? That I do not know. If he did, then forget everything.

[silverback]

Originally Posted by The Crow

I completely disagree. There are a couple things wrong with that.

#1

The hitter, in this case, was a legit tough guy with a history of taking runs and being dirty at times as well as delivering thunderous checks, whereas in the other case, is a Swedish defenseman (Ohlund) who will get at most three fights a season.

#2

The victim,while in both instances is a very good, young player, was injured and will at least have missed one game due to the Neil hit, whereas Kessel returned and played very well afterwards.


While I, as most on here believe it was a good hit, and imo abiding by the rules, there are a few things I can see it being called dirty for. Not in the cheap shot sense, but in the "Dirty yet clean" (see VF's thread) sense. Neil clearly made no effort to touch the puck, and he did end up making contact with Hedman's chin. He also appeared to have left his feet a couple inches (which I personally am not mad in the least about, it was momentum). Combine that with Neil's history of taking runs and playing tougher at home, and his rivalry with Z, and I can at least call his comments understandable. Konopka has been a team captain and has said numerous times his teammates are like brothers, and that is why I think this could be "dirty" in his book.

Why should it matter if it's Ohlund hitting Kessel or Neil hitting Hedman? They were both clean hits and both where worthy of redemption. If anything, the Ohlund hit should have more reason for a Leaf player looking for redemption since Kessel was just coming back from an injury.

So because Neil doesn't play nice, he's dirty?

Originally Posted by The Crow

Who's the bitchy little girl?

The Lightning have 2 guys who have beaten Neil according to many on this site, and I'd say Walker is a better fghter than Neil is. You act as if there is something wrong with a team wanting revenge for a hit. You're acting like only teams with tougher players than the other team have the right to say they want reprecussions. Do you realize how pessimistic and dumb that sounds? Konopka didn't "run his mouth". If the media confronts him on the hit, is he supposed to run away or not give his opinion on it?

Konopka is.

Yet again, both of those fights were nothing to write home about. Could you call them wins for the Lightning players? Sure, but they were not beatings by any stretch of the imagination. I would say they were much closer to being draws than anything else.

[The Crow]

Originally Posted by Cat Smasher

Not at all, unless said player didn't even try to do anything about it during the rest of the game.

Did Neil turn him down? That I do not know. If he did, then forget everything.

Yes. Konopka went after Neil and made a clear challenge and followed him around for nearly the entire shift. Had this been the first period or a lopsided score, this discussion would not be taking place.

Originally Posted by silverback

Why should it matter if it's Ohlund hitting Kessel or Neil hitting Hedman? They were both clean hits and both where worthy of redemption. If anything, the Ohlund hit should have more reason for a Leaf player looking for redemption since Kessel was just coming back from an injury.

So because Neil doesn't play nice, he's dirty?

Neil, in my opinion, is a somewhat dirty player, and he has a reputation for being a scumbag and for throwing some borderline hits.

Konopka is.

Yet again, both of those fights were nothing to write home about. Could you call them wins for the Lightning players? Sure, but they were not beatings by any stretch of the imagination. I would say they were much closer to being draws than anything else.

You seem to be implying that the Lightning can't say anything bad about Neil or seek retribution unless they have players that can give Neil "a beating". It makes little sense. Konopka, the FM and PIM league leader is a bitch for seeking returibution for a teammate? I think not.

[silverback]

Originally Posted by The Crow

Kessel wasn't injured, and it wasn't Konopka who hit him. It's not the same thing, they are two different circumstances with different types of players involved.

You're acting like only teams with tougher players than the other team have the right to say they want reprecussions. Do you realize how pessimistic and dumb that sounds?

Look at the above quote and tell me how that is not being completely hypocritical? One situation is okay, yet the other is not based solely on the players involved? You say that it's fine for Konopka to call out Neil, but not okay for Orr to call out Ohlund.

Originally Posted by The Crow

Is there something against a player voicing his opinion on a hit? Please enlighten me.

Apparently, everything is fine as long as the player is on your team.

Look, don't get me wrong I'm all for players saying/doing things that are going to up the ante so to speak. However, Konopka calling the hit dirty when it clearly was not is just retarded. This is the kind of thing the "new NHL" feeds off of.

[silverback]

Originally Posted by The Crow

Had this been the first period or a lopsided score, this discussion would not be taking place.

Neil, in my opinion, is a somewhat dirty player, and he has a reputation for being a scumbag and for throwing some borderline hits.

You seem to be implying that the Lightning can't say anything bad about Neil or seek retribution unless they have players that can give Neil "a beating". It makes little sense. Konopka, the FM and PIM league leader is a bitch for seeking returibution for a teammate? I think not.

This wasn't a lopsided game so we don't know what would've happened. It's still early in the year and the Lightning have already been called out multiple times by the coach and gm for being too soft and not having enough intensity.

So you wouldn't love to have Neil on the Lightning?

I'm not implying anything. Just saying that Konopka sounds like a little girl calling Neil's hit dirty when most of his teammates (Hedman included) say it was perfectly clean. Doesn't mean there can't be retribution, but at least call it what it is...a clean hit that Neil will have to answer for next time they play.

Another thing, even though I don't agree with the whole "the score was to close so we couldn't do anything" excuse. Why didn't the Lightning target the skilled Sens players with good, clean hits? Other than Downie, nobody did a damn thing about your star rookie being leveled. Yet, you're okay with that since Konopka bitches about it in the media and says how Neil will pay next time. I believe someone said something similar, but talk is cheap.

[The Crow]

Originally Posted by silverback

Look at the above quote and tell me how that is not being completely hypocritical? One situation is okay, yet the other is not based solely on the players involved? You say that it's fine for Konopka to call out Neil, but not okay for Orr to call out Ohlund.

When did I say it wasn't OK? I'm saying the situation is irrelevant and didn't happen to begin with, and I don't see how it plays into anything in this thread.

Apparently, everything is fine as long as the player is on your team.

Not at all, it's not just me backing up Konopka here, hell, I was fine with the hit. That's just an ignorant thing to say.

Look, don't get me wrong I'm all for players saying/doing things that are going to up the ante so to speak. However, Konopka calling the hit dirty when it clearly was not is just retarded. This is the kind of thing the "new NHL" feeds off of.

So all this complaining is because you disagree with Konopka's opinion on the hit? Who the hell cares if he said something? Jesus, are you that sensitive?

Originally Posted by silverback

This wasn't a lopsided game so we don't know what would've happened. It's still early in the year and the Lightning have already been called out multiple times by the coach and gm for being too soft and not having enough intensity.

Basically what I was saying, it wasn't the right time in the game for Z to do something.

So you wouldn't love to have Neil on the Lightning?

I'm not sure. He's one of my least favorite players in the league, but so was Downie before he came to Tampa. I saw Steve as a dirty player with overrated skill and was a cheapshot artist. I now realize he's one of the hardest working players on the ice, wins battles for the puck and steps up to anyone. He also sets up many chances with that hard work.

I'm not implying anything. Just saying that Konopka sounds like a little girl calling Neil's hit dirty when most of his teammates (Hedman included) say it was perfectly clean. Doesn't mean there can't be retribution, but at least call it what it is...a clean hit that Neil will have to answer for next time they play.

Again,it seems you're mad because you think Konopka is wrong in calling it a dirty hit. Why could you possibly care so much to complain about it and make unecessary and harsh criticisms? It's his opinion, he says a mere couple sentences about it and he's "running his mouth" and whining to the media".

Another thing, even though I don't agree with the whole "the score was to close so we couldn't do anything" excuse. Why didn't the Lightning target the skilled Sens players with good, clean hits? Other than Downie, nobody did a damn thing about your star rookie being leveled. Yet, you're okay with that since Konopka bitches about it in the media and says how Neil will pay next time. I believe someone said something similar, but talk is cheap.

Wow, give it a rest. They continued to play hockey, and maybe, just maybe, Konopka realized he should continue playing for "the team" and not take a penalty in a key time. This hit won't be forgotten, and I find it ironic you're accusing someone of bitching, even though you're doing the same thing, and to a greater extent.

[silverback]

Originally Posted by The Crow

That isn't what you said, this is:

"I completely disagree. There are a couple things wrong with that.

#1

The hitter, in this case, was a legit tough guy with a history of taking runs and being dirty at times as well as delivering thunderous checks, whereas in the other case, is a Swedish defenseman (Ohlund) who will get at most three fights a season."

If that isn't saying it wasn't OK then I don't know what is.

And I'm not the only one who thinks Konopka sounds stupid calling the hit dirty.

So what happens if the next game is really close? And the one after that? The hit just goes unpunished I guess. Sometimes the situation doesn't allow for a perfect scenario.

If you can't see those same "positive" attributes in Chris Neil, then you are blind. I don't know about you, but I appreciate those qualities even with guys that aren't on my team.

And you are calling me sensitive?

So Konopka is entitled to his opinion but I'm not?

There's a difference in bitching and just calling someone a retard for making a stupid comment, which is what I did. After that, you just felt the need to come to Konopka's defense. Should I not defend my reason for calling him a retard? Again, from reading your earlier comments it seems that some people are entitled to an opinion while others are not, but that doesn't work for me.

Don't know what I did wrong with the quotes above, but that was my response to your above post.

[acd1]

Originally Posted by ToxinX

Are you really saying Vincent Lecavalier should have fought Chris Neil? I know he's having a slow start to the year, but that's no reason to commit suicide! Besides, from the looks of things, Vinny's days of leading the team in FMs and goals are over. He might be in last place for both by the end of the year if he doesn't get his sh*t together.

Don't sell Lecavalier short, he can hold his own with the gloves off, and Niel isn't that big of a threat (he's no SHW). Vinny is the Captain of the team, by him going after Neil, it would not only send a message to the Sens, but to the rest of the league. "Don't mess with our young defensive star, we take his safety very seriously." And hey, maybe a few good scraps are just what Vinny needs to jump-start his game.

[The Crow]

Originally Posted by silverback

There's a difference in bitching and just calling someone a retard for making a stupid comment, which is what I did. After that, you just felt the need to come to Konopka's defense. Should I not defend my reason for calling him a retard? Again, from reading your earlier comments it seems that some people are entitled to an opinion while others are not, but that doesn't work for me.

Don't know what I did wrong with the quotes above, but that was my response to your above post.

I was implying that it was a different situation to Cat Smasher, in the sense that comparing the two don't really make sense, especially when one of which is hypothetical anyway.

Of course everyone is entitled to their opinion, and what I'm saying is you seem to criticising Konopka for having a wrong or "retarded" opinion. Do you think he was lying when he said that comment?

You're telling me that I'm not accepting of other's opinions, yet that is exactly what you're doing.

[ToxinX]

Originally Posted by acd1

Don't sell Lecavalier short, he can hold his own with the gloves off, and Niel isn't that big of a threat (he's no SHW). Vinny is the Captain of the team, by him going after Neil, it would not only send a message to the Sens, but to the rest of the league. "Don't mess with our young defensive star, we take his safety very seriously." And hey, maybe a few good scraps are just what Vinny needs to jump-start his game.

Eh, realistically, I think Vinny fights like crap against any player who actually knows how to fight and would get pounded by Neil. He stood with Iginla during the Cup series, but I think those were seriously rare and special circumstances. That's not me selling him short, that's just my opinion.
I think you're right that it would send a message, regardless of the outcome. I think he does need a scrap or two to shake him out of this funk he's in, I just don't think a guy of Neil's caliber is the place to start.

[gdameo]

Neil is a dirty player but he do delivery tons of clean hits. This hit was clean and I understand why some people didn't like it because Hedman is a rookie and all but it is Neil's job. That's why he's in the league.

I'm really impressed with Hedman's attitude. He's man enough to say that it was a clean hit and even laughed about it. I don't blame Kon becuase in this situation Neil should've fight him but he refused. I know it was a clean hit and all but in the ol' time, you just fight.

[Mr-Mustard]

Originally Posted by The Crow

Had the game been 3-0, and had Downie not already gone after Neil, Konopka would dropped em no matter what. Let's face it, the hit was not a blatant dirty one, and I'm sure Konopka (Who CLEARLY challenged and prodded Neil in the 3rd) knew what else was at stake here. I think the game situation kinda ruined this potential.

It's not about whether Neil should be scared of certain guys, it's a team showing that they won't forget about this hit and will get their revenge come April. Konopka edged out Neil anyway this year in most peoples eyes, as did Matt Walker.

If the hit had indeed been dirty, then Konopka or Walker should and would have gone after Neil no matter what the fuking score was.