You Don't See Them Brawl

[spiderarms]

Originally Posted by itsJ.Millertime

Hey Smerri, have you ever seen SO MANY EMPTY SEATS for a Bruins home opener?
I have'nt, not even last year. My favorite part of this "new" nhl is the empty seats.
Bad attendance, horrible TV ratings, scoring nearing the clutch and grab era and a stadium that sounds like a morgue.
It won't be long now guys. 2 years tops till hockey returns!

If the "You see them Brawl" Kids stopped buying the packages and promoting the BETTMAN-KOOL-AID. What amazes me, is night after night, come rain or shine, their on that thread, watching player after player scratched and not seeing any of the fights they predict but yet the next night their doing the same thing. If it wasn't so sad and the fact that its costing us REAL HOCKEY FANS OUR SPORT, I be laughing my *** off.

[itsJ.Millertime]

Check out the thread I just started about the Jeremy Jacobs interview. I think you'll find it very interesting. He pretty much contradicts all of bettmans claims of how well this "new" nhl is doing.

[OBA]

You got to understand that Bettywomen will never say that the league is faltering in certain aspects.

I read your interview post, I.J.M.T. Thanks for sharing. We'll from that, and seeing how Jacobs is not to pleased, we NEED other owners, GM's, and higher up's to express the same!

Sort of like a buck the system type of guy, who can actually have an altering effect to change the game back to what made it so great. This would have more pull than anything else.

Have not watched a game all year to date. What am I missing!? - Nothing I say! I viewed the fights so far here from fellow posters, and David himself. They are even lacking the intensity of a good fight. Some cases getting Majors WAS NOT warranted. I see desperate posters in the 'You see them brawl thread'. They are upset that their teams heavy/energy type player is NOT playing. Duh! They just don't seem to get it. The trickle down effect is also happening now. A VERY tough league, the AHL, has seen this year all their main attractions and fighters scratched for some pussie visor wearing Euro in most cases. I say limit the number of Euro's to TWO per team, or none at all. Can't stand Ice Skaters playing hockey.

I can't wait to re-visit the October 14 thread soon, and ask those optimistic posters how they feel the game will turn into 1992 or earlier again! What nerve on those kids to think like that. Reality and the truth just don't sink in on some, as it does on others I guess.

[jayc948]

Originally Posted by spiderarms

If the "You see them Brawl" Kids stopped buying the packages and promoting the BETTMAN-KOOL-AID. What amazes me, is night after night, come rain or shine, their on that thread, watching player after player scratched and not seeing any of the fights they predict but yet the next night their doing the same thing. If it wasn't so sad and the fact that its costing us REAL HOCKEY FANS OUR SPORT, I be laughing my *** off.

Haha, so you really think that is a major cause as to why fighting and physical play is not increasing? Using your logic, I guess this site could always stop supporting hockey and shut down. That would certainly help the effort to make Bettman and his clan see that things need to change, right?

[spiderarms]

Originally Posted by jayc948

Haha, so you really think that is a major cause as to why fighting and physical play is not increasing? Using your logic, I guess this site could always stop supporting hockey and shut down. That would certainly help the effort to make Bettman and his clan see that things need to change, right?

I believe that some of the attitudes expressed by "NEW NHL"
SUPPORTERS on the "YOU SEE THEM BRAWL" threads are indicative
of an existing sentiment in the NHL hockey market place, DENIAL OF THE OBVIOUS, thus directly contributing to the ACCEPTANCE OF A LESSER PHYSICAL GAME IN THE NHL.

Is it solely responsible for the lack of physical play in the NHL? ABSOLUTELY NOT.

MY LOGIC IS, If your buying a product that you are NOT SATISFIED
WITH, (Which most of the posters on this thread say their not)
Why should the manufacturer change it if you are going to continue to buy it anyway?
He is already getting your money, no matter what.
What is his incentive to change it back?

As far as the logic regarding this Website, there are MANY threads other than the "YOU PRAY TO SEE THEM BRAWL" thread on here. This is a GREAT WEBSITE and to my knowledge, this website is about "ALL" hockey leagues, not just the NHL.

I DO NOT AGREE with you that my logic is paramount to "shutting down this website thinking that Bettman and company will take notice". I DON'T BELIEVE THAT AND NEITHER DO YOU! In fact, I will be the first one in line to support the NHL again as I have for over 40years, WHEN and IF they provide us with the product that we all expect. Until that time, there is plenty for us to talk about and discuss as we have many fantastic memories to recollect, while we all anxiously await the return of GREAT HOCKEY TO THE NHL.

[jayc948]

Originally Posted by spiderarms

I believe that some of the attitudes expressed by "NEW NHL"
SUPPORTERS on the "YOU SEE THEM BRAWL" threads are indicative
of an existing sentiment in the NHL hockey market place, DENIAL OF THE OBVIOUS, thus directly contributing to the ACCEPTANCE OF A LESSER PHYSICAL GAME IN THE NHL.

Is it solely responsible for the lack of physical play in the NHL? ABSOLUTELY NOT.

MY LOGIC IS, If your buying a product that you are NOT SATISFIED
WITH, (Which most of the posters on this thread say their not)
Why should the manufacturer change it if you are going to continue to buy it anyway?
He is already getting your money, no matter what.
What is his incentive to change it back?

As far as the logic regarding this Website, there are MANY threads other than the "YOU PRAY TO SEE THEM BRAWL" thread on here. This is a GREAT WEBSITE and to my knowledge, this website is about "ALL" hockey leagues, not just the NHL.

I DO NOT AGREE with you that my logic is paramount to "shutting down this website thinking that Bettman and company will take notice". I DON'T BELIEVE THAT AND NEITHER DO YOU! In fact, I will be the first one in line to support the NHL again as I have for over 40years, WHEN and IF they provide us with the product that we all expect. Until that time, there is plenty for us to talk about and discuss as we have many fantastic memories to recollect, while we all anxiously await the return of GREAT HOCKEY TO THE NHL.

I don't think the activity in those threads is indicative of the sentiment of the fans on here - If you read through the thread there are still posts filled with frustration, it's something that's not going away. I think I speak for everyone on here when I say that we would love an increase in fights and physical play.

Is it directly contributing to a general acceptance of the game? No, it's not - People are going to watch hockey no matter what. Why? Because it's hockey, it's the sport that they love. There have been thousands of letters sent, not just by us, but by people who are frustrated with the product. Look at the arenas each night, the lower levels have hundreds of empty seats. We aren't the only ones frustrated.

Bettman and his crew are dead set into turning the NHL and the sport itself into the exact product they envision. It's a real shame too...

Reading your earlier post, how can one not think that you want that? I think my statement was rational, albeit pretty straightforward and stern, but it made my point clear. You want us to stop following the product so we can send a message to Bettman and the Board of Governors, correct? Well then we would have to stop taping games to get clips of each night's fights by turning off our television sets. Shut down HF's news service reporting various NHL transactions, injuries, and the like. It doesn't seem logical, I know - that's why I'm not in agreement with you.

In regards to the message boards, I enjoy recalling classic scraps and fights from the past, many on here do. You just can't criticize those who choose to follow the game and the fights now, it's unfair. Just because you disagree with the state of the game, doesn't mean that you have the right to poke fun at those who might be enjoying it or who may be trying to salvage whatever physical play/fighting they can get out of it.

[Smerri1029]

Originally Posted by itsJ.Millertime

Hey Smerri, have you ever seen SO MANY EMPTY SEATS for a Bruins home opener?
I have'nt, not even last year. My favorite part of this "new" nhl is the empty seats.
Bad attendance, horrible TV ratings, scoring nearing the clutch and grab era and a stadium that sounds like a morgue.
It won't be long now guys. 2 years tops till hockey returns!

It was pretty sad to see that for a home opener. The Bruins, an original 6, in a great hockey town, not selling out the home opener. It was sad.
And no, Ive been to the last 5 home openers (yeah, I was a sucker and spent 28$ on tickets for 3rd row balc and went) and never have I seen it so empty.

[wellzy]

thats hard to believe that in Boston at a home opener it wasnt sold out. that rite there should be a message tellin the NHL board that hockey is not what it used to be.

[spiderarms]

Originally Posted by jayc948

I don't think the activity in those threads is indicative of the sentiment of the fans on here - If you read through the thread there are still posts filled with frustration, it's something that's not going away. I think I speak for everyone on here when I say that we would love an increase in fights and physical play.

My reference to those "threads" as I stated was "indicative" to the "HOCKEY MARKET PLACE" in general, not this website. I'm not lumping everyone into one big basket here. Allow me to speak for myself.
Most everyone on this WEBSITE,(appropriately named for HOCKEY FIGHTS), enjoys fighting, that's a given, but it is obvious that some like it more than others as can be attested to by some of the posts regarding the demotions of the ENFORCERS, the derogatory comments about their abilities to play the game and the disrespectful comments about the services that they have provided. Couple this with comments regarding the enjoyment of the "NEW" game over the old, not missing the fights and statements of being willing to continue watching hockey with no fights at all..

Is it directly contributing to a general acceptance of the game? No, it's not - People are going to watch hockey no matter what. Why? Because it's hockey, it's the sport that they love. There have been thousands of letters sent, not just by us, but by people who are frustrated with the product. Look at the arenas each night, the lower levels have hundreds of empty seats. We aren't the only ones frustrated.

We disagree here, this goes back to my comments about buying NHL CENTER ICE PACKAGES. You have to start somewhere to make changes happen, no matter how hopeless YOU think it is, THAT'S YOUR OPINION, NOT MINE. Otherwise IMO, it will definitely never happen! People are not going to watch hockey just because its hockey!
IF THE GAME IS BORING, ITS NOT HOCKEY.
That is why you have empty seats, low TV Ratings and people on this very site tuning out and I'm one of many of them, you are not and that's your right..

Bettman and his crew are dead set into turning the NHL and the sport itself into the exact product they envision. It's a real shame too...

This is contrary to many comments I have heard over the past month by posters stating that the players and referees need more time to adjust to the rules. Which I disagree with. I agree that Bettman and Company want to eliminate fighting and rough play, I've been saying that all along!

Reading your earlier post, how can one not think that you want that? I think my statement was rational, albeit pretty straightforward and stern, but it made my point clear. You want us to stop following the product so we can send a message to Bettman and the Board of Governors, correct? Well then we would have to stop taping games to get clips of each night's fights by turning off our television sets. Shut down HF's news service reporting various NHL transactions, injuries, and the like. It doesn't seem logical, I know - that's why I'm not in agreement with you.

What fights? What Clips? There are no fights. Fighting this year is worse than last year! My comments were directed at the purchasing of NHL CENTER ICE PACKAGES and the CONSTENT COMPLAINTS by these buyers that they are not getting what they are paying for! IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, DON'T BUY IT! DOES THIS OR DOES THIS NOT CONTRIBUTE TO THE SUCCESS OF THE NEW NHL? YES IT DOES. IT STATES THAT CUSTOMERS ARE HAPPY WITH THE WAY
THE GAME IS BEING PLAYED NOW.
Does this infer that HOCKEY FIGHTS.COM has to shutdown its operations, NO WAY!
I never said that and if you think this site has to close up shop because of cancelled NHL CENTER ICE PACKAGES, I strongly disagree with you.

In regards to the message boards, I enjoy recalling classic scraps and fights from the past, many on here do. You just can't criticize those who choose to follow the game and the fights now, it's unfair. Just because you disagree with the state of the game, doesn't mean that you have the right to poke fun at those who might be enjoying it or who may be trying to salvage whatever physical play/fighting they can get out of it.

The thread that you posted YOUR comments on "YOU DON"T SEE THEM BRAWL" was designed to keep GUYS LIKE ME off the other thread because of negativity towards the NEW NHL. That is why I don't post on the other thread, I respect the wishes of the owner and other posters on there despite what you may think. This thread is for RANTING AND VENTING. That is what I'm doing. And in turn, I guess that's what your doing, which is your right. During the heat of frustration we all get carried away, SO DO YOU JAYC! I'm sure you've read thousands of posts on here, many more "unfair", IN YOUR OPINION, than mine. I have not used profanity, nor have I singled out any individuals, nor have I wrongly tried to interpet the motive of an individual. Those are my comments and opinions and as always I stand behind them.

[jayc948]

Originally Posted by spiderarms

The thread that you posted YOUR comments on "YOU DON"T SEE THEM BRAWL" was designed to keep GUYS LIKE ME off the other thread because of negativity towards the NEW NHL. That is why I don't post on the other thread, I respect the wishes of the owner and other posters on there despite what you may think. This thread is for RANTING AND VENTING. That is what I'm doing. And in turn, I guess that's what your doing, which is your right. During the heat of frustration we all get carried away, SO DO YOU JAYC! I'm sure you've read thousands of posts on here, many more "unfair", IN YOUR OPINION, than mine. I have not used profanity, nor have I singled out any individuals, nor have I wrongly tried to interpet the motive of an individual. Those are my comments and opinions and as always I stand behind them.

It seems that we can agree to disagree on a lot of issues here...

I understand that you were not trying to group everyone together, but with the You Seem Them Brawl kids comment, it really seemed like you were doing it. I agree with your assessment that there is a large number of posters on this site who seem to be content with the current state of the game. However at the same time, you also have to agree that there are just as many if not more who are upset with the direction that the NHL and hockey in general is going, it's one of the main factors in the creation of this thread.

If you think that people aren't making an effort to show the NHL that they are no longer supporting the game then I think you failing to see what is actually going on. Just take a look at some of the articles that have been passed around during the last few weeks concerning the lack of attendance at NHL games, NHL merchandise sales being down even further, and NHL Center Ice subscriptions being cut in half compared to last season. People are definitely making an effort to show their disapproval of the game today.

Finally something we agree on - I'll admit, at the end of last season, throughout the summer, and at the very beginning of this season, I really thought that the rules were the main reason why fighting was down. To some extent, I still do. But when Bettman holds a press conference and tells the media that fighting is down by a high percentage and it's one of the good things about the new game, it gives me seconds thoughts.

There are fights and there are clips, even though they haven't been that excited thus far and are coming at a smaller clip. The ability for HF to host the previous night's fights is one of the main reasons why this website is so popular and remains at the top of the food chain compared to other websites that deal with the hobby. Taking that away would deal a huge blow to our efforts.

I understand that you are trying to follow the regulations of the site and not put down any one individual - I respect that. However I felt with your earlier comment that you were grouping a bunch of posters together and laying a certain amount of blame on them for the lackluster season we are having thus far which in reality couldn't be any farther from the truth. I understand that you were in the heat of the moment, that's why I haven't taken any shots and we have been able to have this conversation in a rational manner...

[Smerri1029]

Originally Posted by wellst

thats hard to believe that in Boston at a home opener it wasnt sold out. that rite there should be a message tellin the NHL board that hockey is not what it used to be.

Yeah, the Boston Globe said attendance was 17,565 out of 17,565 (soldout) but there were just to many open seats so I don't know where they get that information.

[HordiBrusk29]

Originally Posted by Smerri1029

Yeah, the Boston Globe said attendance was 17,565 out of 17,565 (soldout) but there were just to many open seats so I don't know where they get that information.

That's probably the paid attendance. Not the actual attendance itself.

[itsJ.Millertime]

Originally Posted by Smerri1029

Yeah, the Boston Globe said attendance was 17,565 out of 17,565 (soldout) but there were just to many open seats so I don't know where they get that information.

A recent newspaper article stated the nhl is "boosting" the attendance numbers by 30% (IMO it's even more than that). In an effort to acomplish what I do not know other than to have media types who DO NOT watch the games look at the numbers and say, "wow hockeys doing great".
Pretty sad but I'm sure the owners are'nt being fooled when they look out at a 30-40% (or more) empty stadium that sounds like a mourge and remember when it was once full of excited, cheering fans.

[spiderarms]

Originally Posted by jayc948

It seems that we can agree to disagree on a lot of issues here...

I understand that you were not trying to group everyone together, but with the You Seem Them Brawl kids comment, it really seemed like you were doing it. I agree with your assessment that there is a large number of posters on this site who seem to be content with the current state of the game. However at the same time, you also have to agree that there are just as many if not more who are upset with the direction that the NHL and hockey in general is going, it's one of the main factors in the creation of this thread.

I agree with your assessment on this.

If you think that people aren't making an effort to show the NHL that they are no longer supporting the game then I think you failing to see what is actually going on. Just take a look at some of the articles that have been passed around during the last few weeks concerning the lack of attendance at NHL games, NHL merchandise sales being down even further, and NHL Center Ice subscriptions being cut in half compared to last season. People are definitely making an effort to show their disapproval of the game today.

I agree with your assessment on this but I feel MORE can be done by
MORE posters.

Finally something we agree on - I'll admit, at the end of last season, throughout the summer, and at the very beginning of this season, I really thought that the rules were the main reason why fighting was down. To some extent, I still do. But when Bettman holds a press conference and tells the media that fighting is down by a high percentage and it's one of the good things about the new game, it gives me seconds thoughts.

I agree with your comments here, but it shouldn't be second thoughts but a final conclusion.

There are fights and there are clips, even though they haven't been that excited thus far and are coming at a smaller clip. The ability for HF to host the previous night's fights is one of the main reasons why this website is so popular and remains at the top of the food chain compared to other websites that deal with the hobby. Taking that away would deal a huge blow to our efforts.

That's agreed BUT, another reason why this site is SO POPULAR is because of the FORUMS. Don't down play the fact that this site has many popular sections of interest that keeps posters coming back for more.
ITS NOT JUST THE FIGHT VIDEOS and thats where we differ on opinion. WITHOUT VIDEO CLIPS COMING IN NIGHTLY, THERE ARE ARCHIVES TO UTILIZE AS WELL, OF WHICH THIS SITE HAS A VERY LARGE INVENTORY. This is very important and IMO SHOULD BE UTILIZED MORE, ESPECIALLY NOW. If people are coming on this website just for the clips, then chances are there participation will be minimal. THIS WEBSITE WANTS TO BUILD LOYAL PARTICIPATION IMO. IT IS IMPORTANT TO BUILD AND DEVELOP OTHER CHANNELS AS WELL! That's why I realize in effect what you are saying is that it is a conflict of interest for YOU to PUT DOWN the sale of NHL CENTER ICE PACKAGES because YOU are deriving VIDEO CLIPS from it, but by the same token, the loyalty and leadership shown by this website towards the OVERALL SUCCESS AND BENEFIT OF THE NHL's RETURN TO OLD TIME HOCKEY will build loyalty in its customer base and towards the product that draws them in, the HOCKEY FIGHTS.

I understand that you are trying to follow the regulations of the site and not put down any one individual - I respect that. However I felt with your earlier comment that you were grouping a bunch of posters together and laying a certain amount of blame on them for the lackluster season we are having thus far which in reality couldn't be any farther from the truth. I understand that you were in the heat of the moment, that's why I haven't taken any shots and we have been able to have this conversation in a rational manner...

First off, the "blame" that you are commenting on is towards posts made by individuals claiming that the NEW GAME is better than the OLD GAME, that fighting is NOT a necessary part of the game and derogatory comments about "GOONS" in the sport and no place for them. Secondly, it concerns "continual complaints" over the nightly play, the scratches, how boring the games are and how "upset" they are that they have purchased NHL CENTER ICE PACKAGES. Lastly, yes we have had a CONVERSATION IN A RATIONAL MANNER, THAT IS THE WAY IT SHOULD BE IMO.
AS FAR AS THE "SHOTS", I'LL JUST LET YOU KNOW THAT I DON'T "TURTLE".

[spiderarms]

Tonight, Saturday 10/21/06, should have more than a few fights on the NHL SCORECARD. WHY? GARY BETTMAN will want to keep "SOME HOPE" alive for the existing hockey fight fan base by giving the "GREEN LIGHT" to his officials to "LET THEM PLAY". This way he keeps their REVENUE coming in.
A man with no hope is not willing to part with his money! Let's wait and see. He did it last Saturday Night on 10/14/06 !!! THAT's MY PREDICTION FOR TONIGHT!