now times vs. old times

[theknuckler]

Do you all think we're being spoiled in the hockey fight world with all the youtube videos and the right on demand videos that are available to us? What the hell did the early fight fans do? Do you think they just watched their local news and waited for fights? I know that before the highspeed internet came, it was very hard for a hockeyfight fan to communicate with another fightfan.. Hell I hardly had another fight fan to talk to until this site came around.

Do you guys think that all the new technology has hurt the 'hockey-fight' aspect of the game?

[Fotiu]

I think the new rules hurt the hockeyfight aspect of the game.
It´s great that all those fights are available so we who live outside of Quebec can follow the LNAH for example.

[fansince65]

Originally Posted by theknuckler

Do you all think we're being spoiled in the hockey fight world with all the youtube videos and the right on demand videos that are available to us? What the hell did the early fight fans do? Do you think they just watched their local news and waited for fights? I know that before the highspeed internet came, it was very hard for a hockeyfight fan to communicate with another fightfan.. Hell I hardly had another fight fan to talk to until this site came around.

Do you guys think that all the new technology has hurt the 'hockey-fight' aspect of the game?

Back in the day as we are prone to say the only fight's we got to see were televised games or games you attended in person they very seldom showed clips on the news of hockey fights .. the fights were not considered a big part of the game just something that happened during a game . If their was something big like the Green/Macki stick swinging thing they showed that...
All the new video teck that we have now is what made the hockey fight a big demand item before that their was not much intrest ...

[itsJ.Millertime]

Originally Posted by fansince65

Back in the day as we are prone to say the only fight's we got to see were televised games or games you attended in person they very seldom showed clips on the news of hockey fights .. the fights were not considered a big part of the game just something that happened during a game . If their was something big like the Green/Macki stick swinging thing they showed that...
All the new video teck that we have now is what made the hockey fight a big demand item before that their was not much intrest ...

It absolutely boggles my mind what world of hockey you live (or lived) in or why you are even on this site. Maybe in the 60's this would be true but beyond that you are way, way off.

Theknuckler,
discard this last post and take it from someone who actually loves fights in hockey and will give you a HONEST reply.

I started watching hockey in 79 and at that time cable tv was a very new invention and espn was years away but I was able to get 3 channels that featured NHL games. WSBK/TV38 carried the Bruins, WOR/TV9 carried the Rangers and Islanders and USA cable network carried a live game every week which featured the best matchup. Between those 3 channels there were games nearly every night.

Of course between period clips provided fight highlights and many sports segements on news telecasts featured clips of local teams fights. Some sports casters (namely Marv Albert and Warner Wolf) had a "fight of the night" clip that featured the best fight from games around the league. Sometimes in fact if the game was rough enough they would show more clips of fights than goals. Thats a far cry from what fansince65 wants you to believe but its the truth. Fights were important and extremly popular then, way more so than today, and the news channels knew why people were watching and cared about their ratings so they took every opportunity to show a big fight. This went on throughout the late 70's and well into the 80's until ESPN came along and took over the sports highlights field, but trust me the fight highlights did not stop then as ESPN also featured clips of many fights.

Also for hardcore fight fans like myself there were adds in the "hockey news" classifieds for guys selling/trading fight tapes of their local teams. I traded and bought tapes from several of those guys throughout the 80's and into the 90's. I would guess I saw close to 70% of the NHL fights that occured every year from the late 70's into the 90's and even some minor a junior league fights if the guy I was doing business with lived a area that featured those games. All in all I saw easily thousands of hockey fights from that era.

I would also just write to those same guys and coverse about big fights, big fighters and rough games but it would take a week or 2 before a response would come because of mail delivery time.

So as you can see althought the process was a bit slower the result was the same and if you truly loved the fights it was very easy to keep up with big games, fights and players if you wanted too.

[fansince65]

Originally Posted by itsJ.Millertime

It absolutely boggles my mind what world of hockey you live (or lived) in or why you are even on this site. Maybe in the 60's this would be true but beyond that you are way, way off.

Theknuckler,
discard this last post and take it from someone who actually loves fights in hockey and will give you a HONEST reply.

I started watching hockey in 79 and at that time cable tv was a very new invention and espn was years away but I was able to get 3 channels that featured NHL games. WSBK/TV38 carried the Bruins, WOR/TV9 carried the Rangers and Islanders and USA cable network carried a live game every week which featured the best matchup. Between those 3 channels there were games nearly every night.

Of course between period clips provided fight highlights and many sports segements on news telecasts featured clips of local teams fights. Some sports casters (namely Marv Albert and Warner Wolf) had a "fight of the night" clip that featured the best fight from games around the league. Sometimes in fact if the game was rough enough they would show more clips of fights than goals. Thats a far cry from what fansince65 wants you to believe but its the truth. Fights were important and extremly popular then, way more so than today, and the news channels knew why people were watching and cared about their ratings so they took every opportunity to show a big fight. This went on throughout the late 70's and well into the 80's until ESPN came along and took over the sports highlights field, but trust me the fight highlights did not stop then as ESPN also featured clips of many fights.

Also for hardcore fight fans like myself there were adds in the "hockey news" classifieds for guys selling/trading fight tapes of their local teams. I traded and bought tapes from several of those guys throughout the 80's and into the 90's. I would guess I saw close to 70% of the NHL fights that occured every year from the late 70's into the 90's and even some minor a junior league fights if the guy I was doing business with lived a area that featured those games. All in all I saw easily thousands of hockey fights from that era.

I would also just write to those same guys and coverse about big fights, big fighters and rough games but it would take a week or 2 before a response would come because of mail delivery time.

So as you can see althought the process was a bit slower the result was the same and if you truly loved the fights it was very easy to keep up with big games, fights and players if you wanted too.

You had better read my post again . I said before the Video teck their was not much intrest in hockey fights but that all changed with TV..
You started to watch hockey in 79 you said . Thats 14 years after i started !!A lot of things happened in that 14 years to make hockey fights the thing to watch the video tape being the biggest in the hockey world to come along after TV ..
I dont collect fight tapes but I enjoy a good fight as much as the next guy but my life dosent revolve around hockey fights like yours seams to I am a hockey fan first and foremost to me the "game" comes first and always will the fights to me are just a part of the game If they ban fighting I will still watch hockey thats why I buy my season tickets not to watch a couple goons beat each other up ..Just my opinion...

[kuech13]

I remember back in the time before cable we got the game of the week on Sundays. We had the local minor league team which gave us plenty of fights. After reading this it brought back a memory of buying the hockey news and the first thing I did was go to the back and read the box scores. I imagined all of those fights as toe to toe. As I got older and started collecting tapes I realized most of those fights were probably hugging and wrestling but still it was the moment of my youth and imagination that counted on those days.

[Ciccarelli]

I can tell you that without internet, sat-tv and other new technologies in some countries, like Italy for example, you would not even know about what's going on in the NHL, not to talk about the fights.
I can remember that in the late 80's early 90's the only thing I saw about the NHL where 2 days old results in a corner of the sports-page of the local paper.

The good thing 20 years ago was that most of the predicted fights came true, so it was easier to see the fight because you knew already before the games what fight would happen. Nowadays you can only hope for fights and on game-day you have to flip through channels/games to see a fight. Maybe in some ways it was easier to see them because you knew they would happen.

[metalrider]

Millertime, one of the best posts I read in a while. Thanks!

[itsJ.Millertime]

Originally Posted by fansince65

You had better read my post again . I said before the Video teck their was not much intrest in hockey fights but that all changed with TV..
You started to watch hockey in 79 you said . Thats 14 years after i started !!A lot of things happened in that 14 years to make hockey fights the thing to watch the video tape being the biggest in the hockey world to come along after TV ..
I dont collect fight tapes but I enjoy a good fight as much as the next guy but my life dosent revolve around hockey fights like yours seams to I am a hockey fan first and foremost to me the "game" comes first and always will the fights to me are just a part of the game If they ban fighting I will still watch hockey thats why I buy my season tickets not to watch a couple goons beat each other up ..Just my opinion...

Thats a crap excuse and lame post. I did read it again and it does not change anything.
Heres your origianl post:

Back in the day as we are prone to say the only fight's we got to see were televised games or games you attended in person they very seldom showed clips on the news of hockey fights .. the fights were not considered a big part of the game just something that happened during a game . If their was something big like the Green/Macki stick swinging thing they showed that...
All the new video teck that we have now is what made the hockey fight a big demand item before that their was not much intrest ...

You actually mention televised games and newcasts as NOT showing fight clips and then go on to say "All the NEW video teck that we have NOW".
This was just another of your lame attempts to demeen the fans of fighting and take another of your hockey does not need fighting stances. I am proud of you that you waste your money on todays garbage "new" nhl but what does that prove? Just what I have said, you are anti fight.

Yes I am a huge fan of fights, its the best part of the game if you ask me and I have never said otherwise. Without physical play, intensity and fighting as a large part of the sport the game is unwatchable and boring. A bunch of guys skating around fancy and free, going up and down the ice for 5 min without a check or physical battle insuing is not my idea of entertainment, just my opinion.

I enjoy hard nosed physical sports like football, mma and what hockey used to be. That is why I am a member of a fight site, but your continuous attempts to put down the members of this site who like myself enjoy the fights first and foremost is getting a little old as is your attempts to make it sound like enforcers and fighting has never played a huge part in a teams success. Maybe you would be better off joining a site like HFboards or any of the other sites dedicated to the european, finnesse style of game hockey now is.

Just a suggestion knuckler, in the future you may be better off posting questions like this concerning old time hockey in the "Remember When?" section of this site. There are a lot of old time fans like myself who followed this sport since the 70's and before but they dont generaly venture off that section to post mainly for reasons like our friend "fansince65" here. You will most likely get a better response.

[srehm1]

I can only say from my own personal experience that it has become easier to catch up on your fights today then previously. That's not to say that you couldn't, but it all took much longer. Growing up in Boston my friends and I came into a tradition of tough hockey and we all loved the fights. Someone in the neighborhood always had a fight tape you could borrow. We all loved Neely, Miller, Byers, O'Reilly -- although he was getting on in years. We had WSBK CH. 38 which televised Bruins games and that was my fix right there. They televised tons of games. Of course I saw a few at the garden as well.

NESN came along and then you could watch every B's game of the year. I also used to count on a fledgling ESPN for the odd hockey game as well. Sportcenter always showed highlights of the real good fights.

Does anyone remember George Michael's Sports Machine? He loved to show fights in his highlights. I think he used to do a fight of the week clip. I think it was a weekly show that came on late night, but that was a way to catch up on fight footage.

Once the VCR came around anyone could get hockey fight tapes. I saw an add in the Boston Herald for hockey fight tapes. That's actually how I got started. Then there was different ads in hockey magazines. I believe I saw an add in Hockey Digest for hockey fights. Once that happened I would lend my tapes out to friends (some I never got back ) or I'd borrow and copy another friends.

Now with the internet I can just jump on youtube or DYG for clips. Hell there's a ton of fight clips on this site as well. The internet has made it easier. Now I can trade with a variety of people where that was not possible before. I used to just trade with people from my neighborhood -- just my friends. Now I can trade with a guy from Sweden. Or Australia.

It is easier today, but if you were a fight fan, you could find them back then. I don't know maybe it was easier where I grew up -- we all loved sports and hockey had fighting in it which always appealed to young Irish kids.

[canuckfan]

I think I know what fansince65 is trying to say here.

I recently read Ralph Mellanby's terrific book "Walking with Legends". He is the former producer of Hockey Night in Canada. In it are terrific stories from inside the broadcast booth and behind the scenes at HNIC.

In the book, Mellanby states how back in the 1960s and beyond, CBC was not allowed to show fights on television. When one broke out, camera's would consistently shift away or the network would break to a commercial. No one even dared to replay a fight on television. This would help to explain the lack of footage of hockey fights during the era of the Original 6 - the networks weren't allowed to!

I covered this in another thread a few months back, but I'll repeat it here, because I beleive every fan of hockey fights should know who Ralph Mellanby is and what he did to help revolutionize our sport on television. In 1968, Mellanby and Dan Kelly finally got permission to show fights on tv, but they were not allowed to replay them or show highlites. This, apparantly, was the demands of HNIC sponsors like Molson and Imperial Oil. In the '68 playoffs, CBC joined a game late, featuring the Bruins and the Canadiens. At the beginning of the game, John Ferguson had beat the crap out of Teddy Green, but CBC had missed this because they tuned in too late. It was obvious to Mellanby that the fight had a major impact on the game and had fired up the Habs and the fans. During the first intermission, Mellanby and Kelly made hockey history when they went against policy and replayed the fight, stating that it had some major importance on the current flow of the game.

Mellanby thought he was as good as fired after this, but the viewers responded so positively that his job was safe, Kelly's popularity soared, the CBC began not just televising fights more often, but replaying them as well for those who might have missed them. As more fights were televised and replayed, hockey fights began showing up on news reports and highlite packages, and the rougher side of hockey grew in populaity immensely - this probably helped inspire tough teams from the 1970s like the Bruins and the Flyers. This also helps explain why there isn't much footage of guys like Richard, Howe, and Ferguson fighting - it just doesn't exist becuase networks either were not allowed to or didn't bother.

So, when fansince65 is saying that you rarely saw them back in the 1960s unless you were there at the arena or watching them live, he's right on the money. Fighting has always been a part of the game, but I don't think it was really truly enjoyed or discussed habitually by fans to the extent they are today until they started televising/replaying more fights and brawls beginning in the late 1960s and early 1970s. There seems to be a natural evoltion of the hockey fights and how its been recorded/documented going back to at least 1968. I think there's a direct link between Mellanby and Kelly's actions that night to web site's like this one today.

So as its been increasingly televised and covered, so has the hockey fight's popularity. It wasn't that popular back then because hardly anyone saw them!

[The Don]

Originally Posted by canuckfan

I think I know what fansince65 is trying to say here.

I recently read Ralph Mellanby's terrific book "Walking with Legends". He is the former producer of Hockey Night in Canada. In it are terrific stories from inside the broadcast booth and behind the scenes at HNIC.

In the book, Mellanby states how back in the 1960s and beyond, CBC was not allowed to show fights on television. When one broke out, camera's would consistently shift away or the network would break to a commercial. No one even dared to replay a fight on television. This would help to explain the lack of footage of hockey fights during the era of the Original 6 - the networks weren't allowed to!

I covered this in another thread a few months back, but I'll repeat it here, because I beleive every fan of hockey fights should know who Ralph Mellanby is and what he did to help revolutionize our sport on television. In 1968, Mellanby and Dan Kelly finally got permission to show fights on tv, but they were not allowed to replay them or show highlites. This, apparantly, was the demands of HNIC sponsors like Molson and Imperial Oil. In the '68 playoffs, CBC joined a game late, featuring the Bruins and the Canadiens. At the beginning of the game, John Ferguson had beat the crap out of Teddy Green, but CBC had missed this because they tuned in too late. It was obvious to Mellanby that the fight had a major impact on the game and had fired up the Habs and the fans. During the first intermission, Mellanby and Kelly made hockey history when they went against policy and replayed the fight, stating that it had some major importance on the current flow of the game.

Mellanby thought he was as good as fired after this, but the viewers responded so positively that his job was safe, Kelly's popularity soared, the CBC began not just televising fights more often, but replaying them as well for those who might have missed them. As more fights were televised and replayed, hockey fights began showing up on news reports and highlite packages, and the rougher side of hockey grew in populaity immensely - this probably helped inspire tough teams from the 1970s like the Bruins and the Flyers. This also helps explain why there isn't much footage of guys like Richard, Howe, and Ferguson fighting - it just doesn't exist becuase networks either were not allowed to or didn't bother.

So, when fansince65 is saying that you rarely saw them back in the 1960s unless you were there at the arena or watching them live, he's right on the money. Fighting has always been a part of the game, but I don't think it was really truly enjoyed or discussed habitually by fans to the extent they are today until they started televising/replaying more fights and brawls beginning in the late 1960s and early 1970s. There seems to be a natural evoltion of the hockey fights and how its been recorded/documented going back to at least 1968. I think there's a direct link between Mellanby and Kelly's actions that night to web site's like this one today.

So as its been increasingly televised and covered, so has the hockey fight's popularity. It wasn't that popular back then because hardly anyone saw them!

That's one of the best posts I've ever read on here. Very interesting to say the least and suprising as well. I always thought this era was the worst for hockey fight fans.

[fansince65]

Originally Posted by canuckfan

I think I know what fansince65 is trying to say here.

I recently read Ralph Mellanby's terrific book "Walking with Legends". He is the former producer of Hockey Night in Canada. In it are terrific stories from inside the broadcast booth and behind the scenes at HNIC.

In the book, Mellanby states how back in the 1960s and beyond, CBC was not allowed to show fights on television. When one broke out, camera's would consistently shift away or the network would break to a commercial. No one even dared to replay a fight on television. This would help to explain the lack of footage of hockey fights during the era of the Original 6 - the networks weren't allowed to!

I covered this in another thread a few months back, but I'll repeat it here, because I beleive every fan of hockey fights should know who Ralph Mellanby is and what he did to help revolutionize our sport on television. In 1968, Mellanby and Dan Kelly finally got permission to show fights on tv, but they were not allowed to replay them or show highlites. This, apparantly, was the demands of HNIC sponsors like Molson and Imperial Oil. In the '68 playoffs, CBC joined a game late, featuring the Bruins and the Canadiens. At the beginning of the game, John Ferguson had beat the crap out of Teddy Green, but CBC had missed this because they tuned in too late. It was obvious to Mellanby that the fight had a major impact on the game and had fired up the Habs and the fans. During the first intermission, Mellanby and Kelly made hockey history when they went against policy and replayed the fight, stating that it had some major importance on the current flow of the game.

Mellanby thought he was as good as fired after this, but the viewers responded so positively that his job was safe, Kelly's popularity soared, the CBC began not just televising fights more often, but replaying them as well for those who might have missed them. As more fights were televised and replayed, hockey fights began showing up on news reports and highlite packages, and the rougher side of hockey grew in populaity immensely - this probably helped inspire tough teams from the 1970s like the Bruins and the Flyers. This also helps explain why there isn't much footage of guys like Richard, Howe, and Ferguson fighting - it just doesn't exist becuase networks either were not allowed to or didn't bother.

So, when fansince65 is saying that you rarely saw them back in the 1960s unless you were there at the arena or watching them live, he's right on the money. Fighting has always been a part of the game, but I don't think it was really truly enjoyed or discussed habitually by fans to the extent they are today until they started televising/replaying more fights and brawls beginning in the late 1960s and early 1970s. There seems to be a natural evoltion of the hockey fights and how its been recorded/documented going back to at least 1968. I think there's a direct link between Mellanby and Kelly's actions that night to web site's like this one today.

So as its been increasingly televised and covered, so has the hockey fight's popularity. It wasn't that popular back then because hardly anyone saw them!

Thank you Canuckfan !! thats exactly what I was trying to get across !!
Thats not the first time Millertime has jumped all over me for a post .. dont know what his problem with me is .. could be the fact that I have played the game and he hasent ever had skates on in his life ..
I am going out tomorrow and buying that book "Walking With Legends" the name alone tells me it has to be a good one ..(I dont collect fight tapes I collect good hockey books)
Thank you again ....

[Ciccarelli]

Great post, thx canuckfan. Very interesting.

fansince65 don't take it personally if Millertime is jumping all over you, he is doing that constantly also with others, myself included. But he often brings a very interesting view of things into this forum not everybody agrees with but it makes this forum so great.

[fansince65]

Originally Posted by Ciccarelli

Great post, thx canuckfan. Very interesting.

fansince65 don't take it personally if Millertime is jumping all over you, he is doing that constantly also with others, myself included. But he often brings a very interesting view of things into this forum not everybody agrees with but it makes this forum so great.

Thanks Ciccarelli !! I realise that Millertime and I have diffrent views on hockey , I put the game first , he puts the fighting first , just two fans with diffrent points of view , and yes I also enjoy his posts . He has the right to disagree with anyone , but he dose'nt have the right to personally attack anyone you included .. Just my opinion .....