Any Portland Winterhawks questions go here.

[amac3320]

Originally Posted by dadztoy

At what point is BS going to start serving his gamers?

Theres a very confusing rule that the whl has about game misconducts that I'm not gonna take time to explain. So after following the rule the whl says Snake has only 2 misconducts that count towards the 3 misconduct gets you a suspension rule.

[dadztoy]

Originally Posted by amac3320

Theres a very confusing rule that the whl has about game misconducts that I'm not gonna take time to explain. So after following the rule the whl says Snake has only 2 misconducts that count towards the 3 misconduct gets you a suspension rule.

Might I trouble you to give me the Rule NUMBER in the book, as I'm looking at it as we speak....
I see no loop-hole as to this, but if you have one, please share..........

[diva_jen]

Originally Posted by dadztoy

Might I trouble you to give me the Rule NUMBER in the book, as I'm looking at it as we speak....
I see no loop-hole as to this, but if you have one, please share..........

I tried finding it myself and couldn't so I got some help. This is from John Kirby a very knowledgable hockey broadcaster in Portland. This is the entire quote but if you don't believe me you can go here http://www.oregonlive.com/forums/hawks/index.ssf and it is message #4474.1 under Rules Explanation:

"First of all (to make things "fun" for broadcasters ;-) there are really three rule books: (a) the WHL main rule book, (b) the WHL Regulations for Coaches, and (c ) the WHL Team Manual. So I'll refer to them as the "Rule Book", "Coaches Regs" and "Team Manual" respectively.

The Rule Book, rule 28e "Misconducts" says (paraphrasing) -- for your 3rd game misconduct (GM), it's a one game suspension, the 4th GM results in a two game suspension, the 5th GM means a three game suspension. HOWEVER, if a player gets a GM that results (under review) in an immediate suspension for that particular offense, the player's GM "counter" doesn't get incremented for that offense.

Example:* Player A in game #1 gets a major for boarding and an auto GM (but is not given an immediate suspension), the Player A's GM counter goes to 1* Player A in game #2 gets a major for checking from behind (a BIG one) which has an auto GM (and gets an IMMEDIATE suspension for that incident), the the GM counter stays at 1* Player A in game #3 gets a major for high sticking and auto GM (no immediate suspension), the Player A's GM counter goes to 2* Player A in game #4 gets a major for slashing and auto GM, the Player A's GM counter hits 3, and he's suspended automatically for one game

In the case of Snake in the Vancouver game, he was slashed by Appleby (Appleby got a major for slashing and an auto GM). Snake responded with a fight. The ref called Snake for 2 for instigating, 5 for fighting … and since there was a special case (WHL Team Manual, rule 17) -- "score differential of 2 goals or more and less than 5 minutes remaining", instead of the standard 10 min misconduct for instigating, there was an auto GM. Snake's GM counter was 1 going into the game. This TENTATIVELY bumped his GM counter to 2. BUT another rule (Team Manual, page 17) basically says that if another player does something that leads to a confrontation, the "instigator" should not be applied. Clearly Appleby's slash led to the fight, so the ref was in error in giving Snake an instigator penalty (and therefore the auto GM). I spoke with Kevin Muench (Dir of Officials) at Seattle on Saturday (off air). He said they corrected this call to "2 minute roughing + 5 for Fighting", so the auto GM (due to the time remaining in the game and score differential) should not be applied. That kept Snake's counter at 1.

In the Kelowna game the next night, Snake got the major boarding penalty for the hit on Weber. (Which, personally, I think was "one of those accidental things", and shouldn't have been a penalty at all.) In any case, a major for boarding calls for an automatic GM. (Note that the Hawks appealed this to the League office, but the appeal was turned down.) This moved Snake's counter to (only) 2, so there was no auto suspension. "

I hope this clears up the reason why the league allowed Snake to play in Kelowna.

[dadztoy]

Originally Posted by diva_jen

I tried finding it myself and couldn't so I got some help. This is from John Kirby a very knowledgable hockey broadcaster in Portland. This is the entire quote but if you don't believe me you can go here http://www.oregonlive.com/forums/hawks/index.ssf and it is message #4474.1 under Rules Explanation:

"First of all (to make things "fun" for broadcasters ;-) there are really three rule books: (a) the WHL main rule book, (b) the WHL Regulations for Coaches, and (c ) the WHL Team Manual. So I'll refer to them as the "Rule Book", "Coaches Regs" and "Team Manual" respectively.

The Rule Book, rule 28e "Misconducts" says (paraphrasing) -- for your 3rd game misconduct (GM), it's a one game suspension, the 4th GM results in a two game suspension, the 5th GM means a three game suspension. HOWEVER, if a player gets a GM that results (under review) in an immediate suspension for that particular offense, the player's GM "counter" doesn't get incremented for that offense.

Example:* Player A in game #1 gets a major for boarding and an auto GM (but is not given an immediate suspension), the Player A's GM counter goes to 1* Player A in game #2 gets a major for checking from behind (a BIG one) which has an auto GM (and gets an IMMEDIATE suspension for that incident), the the GM counter stays at 1* Player A in game #3 gets a major for high sticking and auto GM (no immediate suspension), the Player A's GM counter goes to 2* Player A in game #4 gets a major for slashing and auto GM, the Player A's GM counter hits 3, and he's suspended automatically for one game

In the case of Snake in the Vancouver game, he was slashed by Appleby (Appleby got a major for slashing and an auto GM). Snake responded with a fight. The ref called Snake for 2 for instigating, 5 for fighting … and since there was a special case (WHL Team Manual, rule 17) -- "score differential of 2 goals or more and less than 5 minutes remaining", instead of the standard 10 min misconduct for instigating, there was an auto GM. Snake's GM counter was 1 going into the game. This TENTATIVELY bumped his GM counter to 2. BUT another rule (Team Manual, page 17) basically says that if another player does something that leads to a confrontation, the "instigator" should not be applied. Clearly Appleby's slash led to the fight, so the ref was in error in giving Snake an instigator penalty (and therefore the auto GM). I spoke with Kevin Muench (Dir of Officials) at Seattle on Saturday (off air). He said they corrected this call to "2 minute roughing + 5 for Fighting", so the auto GM (due to the time remaining in the game and score differential) should not be applied. That kept Snake's counter at 1.

In the Kelowna game the next night, Snake got the major boarding penalty for the hit on Weber. (Which, personally, I think was "one of those accidental things", and shouldn't have been a penalty at all.) In any case, a major for boarding calls for an automatic GM. (Note that the Hawks appealed this to the League office, but the appeal was turned down.) This moved Snake's counter to (only) 2, so there was no auto suspension. "

I hope this clears up the reason why the league allowed Snake to play in Kelowna.

Thanks for all your trouble! I didn't intend for you to do all that. Now if my old brain can figure it all out.......

[diva_jen]

Originally Posted by dadztoy

Thanks for all your trouble! I didn't intend for you to do all that. Now if my old brain can figure it all out.......

Well maybe a small one. LOL But I knew who to ask. I am glad you asked and it was a legit question. If I were in your shoes I would want to know the answer to. So who is your WHL Team?

[dadztoy]

Originally Posted by diva_jen

Well maybe a small one. LOL But I knew who to ask. I am glad you asked and it was a legit question. If I were in your shoes I would want to know the answer to. So who is your WHL Team?

The Ams......

[diva_jen]

subject of Snake, shall we. We won in OT over the Giants on Sunday. In OT Willy called for a stick measurement and Ty Morris was out for two minutes with an illegal stick penalty. Three seconds after the penalty ended, May scores and we win.

Some have been whining about the Illegal Stick call. However, it's on the books and everyone knows Portland will use it. Willy has stated several times that he thinks the rule is stupid but if the boys are working hard he will call for a measurement.

Is this a chickenSh** maneauver or in a tight division race a great idea. Of course, being that it's my team, I think it's a great tool. I also think that teams need to smarten up a bit and switch sticks in a tight game verus portland. I know this was on the white board but for those of you who don't go there, what do you think?

[jstme]

I think that as long as the rule is in the books, that ANY team can use it. It is the choice of the caoch if and when too use it, bu it is there for areason so use it. Portland has got the call against and lost out last year when Spokane called it on Coburn. That was a play-off game that really hurt the hawks to loose. All of the other teams just need to realise that Portland WILL call on it, if there is a need for it, so simply obey the rules, and nothing will happen to your team.

[amac3320]

Originally Posted by diva_jen

subject of Snake, shall we. We won in OT over the Giants on Sunday. In OT Willy called for a stick measurement and Ty Morris was out for two minutes with an illegal stick penalty. Three seconds after the penalty ended, May scores and we win.

Some have been whining about the Illegal Stick call. However, it's on the books and everyone knows Portland will use it. Willy has stated several times that he thinks the rule is stupid but if the boys are working hard he will call for a measurement.

Is this a chickenSh** maneauver or in a tight division race a great idea. Of course, being that it's my team, I think it's a great tool. I also think that teams need to smarten up a bit and switch sticks in a tight game verus portland. I know this was on the white board but for those of you who don't go there, what do you think?

In a race this tight you havve to do whatever you need to to get the win. Players and Coaches are all aware of the rule so they need to make sure it's not called on them. My dad's been calling illegal sticks ever since the ruls came out and he does them all by line of sight. So if your gonna play Portland then you better be aware of that rule